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Hiero Antares
Terror of the Universe

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Orbiting the planet Cecropa
Posts: 4268

GSM and SJR

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Hiero Antares[/i]
[B] Forgive me for this but I feel like it needs to be addressed once and for all. I really hope this is the final thread because I can't express how sick I am of this conflict, and I'm sure everyone else feels the same.

GSM, I started reading that report of yours; I haven't finished it because I honestly don't have enough time, especially this week. You must have put a ton of time into it, which shows how serious an issue this is for you, rightly or wrongly. From what I have read, I'm able to draw some conclusions, so here we go.

There were times when you were definitely unfairly targeted. You invited some of it by A) Bragging about your own accomplishments and putting the rest of us down, and B) Complaining about really minor things like the font size, and basically being unwilling to compromise about it, even when the rest of us are in consensus against you. However, I do see that people sometimes responded to you in very inappropriate ways. Interestingly, the worst incident of it was when Wedge flamed you, not SJR. I remember that and how furious I was, because it was totally uncalled for. SJR also was out of line when he told you that he hated you, and especially when he tried to have you voted off the staff. He has made it pretty clear that he doesn't like you, and has generally treated you with an inappropriate rudeness and haughtiness.

That much I agree with. Where it gets weird is when you then try to take that and conclude that he is "out to get you." A lot of your evidence seemed to be speculation about the kind of "psychology" he was using to turn the others against you, which I frankly don't buy. He in fact said, more than once, that he was willing to get along with you as long as you made an effort to get along with the rest of us. He has not tried to remove you again. He has never talked to me about getting rid of you, and if he has talked to anyone else about it privately, I hope that person will say so. Since all you've showed me is the times that he's been rude to you, I can't draw the conclusion that he's doing this "every chance he gets."

This just needs to stop. It is causing you FAR too much stress and it's annoying the rest of us. We don't have to like each other, but we have to tolerate each other as long as we're all on the same staff. So here are my suggestions.

GSM -- Please drop this paranoia thing. It is not worth anyone's time, especially your own, for you to get upset over statements like the one SJR just made in his last update, which NO ONE would interpret as an insult. Also, stop taking every little criticism as an insult. Most importantly, stop bringing this stuff on yourself by being stubborn about little things like the font size. Compromise is part of what's necessary in group work, and if everyone else wants something for the site that you don't want, you need to accept the will of the majority. The only alternative is escalating conflict. Let these little things go, and people will stop becoming irritated with you. Also, again, it comes off as really rude and conceited when you start talking about how much work you've done for the site. I KNOW you have done a lot of work, but when you brag about being the greatest staffer it just comes off as an insult to the rest of us. Please try to be a bit more modest. If you feel like you're being unfairly attacked, go ahead and say so, but without the defensive bragging.

If you are still honestly convinced that SJR is out to destroy you, be assured that the rest of us won't let him do it. That's not how we do things here. Just please try to change your own behavior a little, and we will all look out for you.

SJR -- I think you should try to recognize and take responsibility for the fact that you've treated him poorly, at least on some occasions. I don't think I've ever in my history at the OA told anyone "I hate you." It was really quite rude, and you were also wrong to try to have him removed from staff, and to threaten to remove his admin powers. Try to be more mature. GSM HAS done a HELL of a lot of work for the site, and he does not deserve for you to call it crap.

How about if you both just apologize to each other and agree to try to make it work one more time? It would be a relief to me, and to the rest of the staff. I'm going to be leaving for a month in a couple of weeks and I really don't want to have to worry about whether GSM and SJR have killed each other.

This is my last try. Please, please help me out, both of you. [/B][/QUOTE]

QuickQuote

Forgive me for this but I feel like it needs to be addressed once and for all. I really hope this is the final thread because I can't express how sick I am of this conflict, and I'm sure everyone else feels the same.

GSM, I started reading that report of yours; I haven't finished it because I honestly don't have enough time, especially this week. You must have put a ton of time into it, which shows how serious an issue this is for you, rightly or wrongly. From what I have read, I'm able to draw some conclusions, so here we go.

There were times when you were definitely unfairly targeted. You invited some of it by A) Bragging about your own accomplishments and putting the rest of us down, and B) Complaining about really minor things like the font size, and basically being unwilling to compromise about it, even when the rest of us are in consensus against you. However, I do see that people sometimes responded to you in very inappropriate ways. Interestingly, the worst incident of it was when Wedge flamed you, not SJR. I remember that and how furious I was, because it was totally uncalled for. SJR also was out of line when he told you that he hated you, and especially when he tried to have you voted off the staff. He has made it pretty clear that he doesn't like you, and has generally treated you with an inappropriate rudeness and haughtiness.

That much I agree with. Where it gets weird is when you then try to take that and conclude that he is "out to get you." A lot of your evidence seemed to be speculation about the kind of "psychology" he was using to turn the others against you, which I frankly don't buy. He in fact said, more than once, that he was willing to get along with you as long as you made an effort to get along with the rest of us. He has not tried to remove you again. He has never talked to me about getting rid of you, and if he has talked to anyone else about it privately, I hope that person will say so. Since all you've showed me is the times that he's been rude to you, I can't draw the conclusion that he's doing this "every chance he gets."

This just needs to stop. It is causing you FAR too much stress and it's annoying the rest of us. We don't have to like each other, but we have to tolerate each other as long as we're all on the same staff. So here are my suggestions.

GSM -- Please drop this paranoia thing. It is not worth anyone's time, especially your own, for you to get upset over statements like the one SJR just made in his last update, which NO ONE would interpret as an insult. Also, stop taking every little criticism as an insult. Most importantly, stop bringing this stuff on yourself by being stubborn about little things like the font size. Compromise is part of what's necessary in group work, and if everyone else wants something for the site that you don't want, you need to accept the will of the majority. The only alternative is escalating conflict. Let these little things go, and people will stop becoming irritated with you. Also, again, it comes off as really rude and conceited when you start talking about how much work you've done for the site. I KNOW you have done a lot of work, but when you brag about being the greatest staffer it just comes off as an insult to the rest of us. Please try to be a bit more modest. If you feel like you're being unfairly attacked, go ahead and say so, but without the defensive bragging.

If you are still honestly convinced that SJR is out to destroy you, be assured that the rest of us won't let him do it. That's not how we do things here. Just please try to change your own behavior a little, and we will all look out for you.

SJR -- I think you should try to recognize and take responsibility for the fact that you've treated him poorly, at least on some occasions. I don't think I've ever in my history at the OA told anyone "I hate you." It was really quite rude, and you were also wrong to try to have him removed from staff, and to threaten to remove his admin powers. Try to be more mature. GSM HAS done a HELL of a lot of work for the site, and he does not deserve for you to call it crap.

How about if you both just apologize to each other and agree to try to make it work one more time? It would be a relief to me, and to the rest of the staff. I'm going to be leaving for a month in a couple of weeks and I really don't want to have to worry about whether GSM and SJR have killed each other.

This is my last try. Please, please help me out, both of you.

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07-28-2004 09:04 PM

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VGF
Thalla gu Taigh na Galla

Registered: Apr 2003
Location:
Posts: 275

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by VGF[/i]
[B] Ok guys... I know it's been AGES since I've posted much, and I've stayed away from the site issues since I felt since I wasn't able to be involved as much, I had less right to jump in.

That said - I will say I've followed this in mods and admins over the past several months.

Nobody has to like each other - but a modicum of civility and respect towards each other, particularly in public, is part of what's expected of taking the responsibility of being staff, whether it's as a mod or admin, or site staffer.  Like it or not, you guys set the tone for what is and isn't not only acceptable, but expected attitude and behaviour from the members here.

No, it's not the first time there have been personal arguments and issues flare up between staffers.  However - they were always just that, personal.  This has differed in that the reputations of the individuals as staffers were also called publicly into question, not just as people.

This needs to be settled once and for all, and buried and left for dead, not resurrected, and not brought up for the grave to be danced on repeatedly.  Leia is leaving for a month - and the last thing she needs to worry about is whether there will be interesting barbs, insults, and other less than civil and courteous conduct for each other and the site going on in her absence.

Come on guys - you're capable of better than this.  Agree to disagree if you must - but move past this and focus on maintaining the site instead of each other's perceived personal faults, ok?  I'll be around a bit more than I have been (I know, sorry, you'll just have to put up with me), and I'd really like to enjoy working with everyone again :p

Zhai'helleva [/B][/QUOTE]

QuickQuote

Ok guys... I know it's been AGES since I've posted much, and I've stayed away from the site issues since I felt since I wasn't able to be involved as much, I had less right to jump in.

That said - I will say I've followed this in mods and admins over the past several months.

Nobody has to like each other - but a modicum of civility and respect towards each other, particularly in public, is part of what's expected of taking the responsibility of being staff, whether it's as a mod or admin, or site staffer. Like it or not, you guys set the tone for what is and isn't not only acceptable, but expected attitude and behaviour from the members here.

No, it's not the first time there have been personal arguments and issues flare up between staffers. However - they were always just that, personal. This has differed in that the reputations of the individuals as staffers were also called publicly into question, not just as people.

This needs to be settled once and for all, and buried and left for dead, not resurrected, and not brought up for the grave to be danced on repeatedly. Leia is leaving for a month - and the last thing she needs to worry about is whether there will be interesting barbs, insults, and other less than civil and courteous conduct for each other and the site going on in her absence.

Come on guys - you're capable of better than this. Agree to disagree if you must - but move past this and focus on maintaining the site instead of each other's perceived personal faults, ok? I'll be around a bit more than I have been (I know, sorry, you'll just have to put up with me), and I'd really like to enjoy working with everyone again

Zhai'helleva

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"Cum do theanga ablaich gun fheum"
"Cairdeas, Gaolaich, Dilseachd"

Merchant SJR: Oh my god. He's in love with me, isn't he?
dimichan: or wanted you to be his studmuffin?
Julius Arcane: I'd say studmuffin
Merchant SJR: Oh, Illy!
Julius Arcane: I'd be careful around Valentine's Day, if I were you
Merchant SJR: He's got to work for this booty
Prince Illjwamh: awesome
Merchant SJR: OH!
Merchant SJR: OH!
Prince Illjwamh: yes!

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07-28-2004 10:17 PM

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Jesus
___l\___\o/____ AAH! SHARK

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: hey fuck you
Posts: 5636

Hey, I remember you!

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07-29-2004 09:17 AM

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GreatSaiyaman777
Member

Registered: Apr 2003
Location:
Posts: 2447

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by GreatSaiyaman777[/i]
[B] I really wish you would have read through the whole report before commenting on it.  That being said,

"SJR- "This, however, is wrong. I am going to continue doing what I can for this site, whatever the case may be. I am now, and always have been, proud to be a staff member of this site. If Leia goes, which I hope she doesn't, I'm staying. If she stays, I'm staying. However, if Illy leaves, I'm gonna be pissed, and will take over Illyland. But I'm staying.

Saiyaman, you can go fuck yourself. I'm going to put it to a vote. Ever since the last time you royally pissed me off, I wanted you gone."

SJR- "We did NOT come to a conclusion, dumbass. YOU said that, and no one agreed with you.

I suggest you check out these threads.

[url]http://www.dbzoa.net/forum/showthre...25&pagenumber=2[/url]

[url]http://www.dbzoa.net/forum/showthre...=&threadid=4245[/url]"

"I didn't hate you until that day, true. But not for the reasons you listed."

"Merchant SJR: Yes, I'm a psycho, and everything I do is a powerplay to take over the site
Merchant SJR: Golllllllllly!"
"Merchant SJR: Me, VGF, Ski, Leia, you, Wedge, Illy, Masa, Kaeli
Merchant SJR: 9
Merchant SJR: Who would vote you off?
Merchant SJR: Me, Wedge, Ski, Illy, Kaeli
Merchant SJR: That's 5
GSaiyaman777: so?
Merchant SJR: So...
Merchant SJR: Simply math
Merchant SJR: That's over half
GSaiyaman777: Ilj, I don't know what his problem
GSaiyaman777: and you and Kaeli must be good friends
Merchant SJR: That's politics for you"

Merchant SJR: I will tell you right now
Merchant SJR: I don't fucking care.
Merchant SJR: Think of me as the obsessive that wants you gone. I don't care."

I have been through a LOT of shit and a LOT of stress because of the harassment I've been through the past several months thanks to SJR.  It's no different than what happened to Cleo, except that people actually believed Cleo instead of dismissing what she had to say.

And Ilj also needs to leave me alone too. He's given me a lot of shit even though I've done nothing to him and has "stood behind" SJR in every attack and insult he's thrown at me while acting innocent and "insisting" he doesn't know what hell I'm talking about every time I ask him to stop and treating ever insult as a "non-insult", even though he's insulted me more than anyone else here, and I'm pretty much the only person he targets for insult.

I tried to get along with SJR, he promised he'd "leave me alone" and even after I was getting my own site he still wouldn't stop doing crap like harassing me and editing my work anonymously.  SJR also almost got me kicked out on a lie, stating that I was "plannning on leaving the site" which resulted in Ilj trying to kick me off.

"14 Ilj- "I want you gone. NOW. Kevin and Pete are my friends, and I will NOT allow you to talk about them and treat them that way. I asked SJR to readmin me because this has gone far enough. I thought I just needed a vacation from your bullshit, but what everyone really needs is a vacation from you.

This is an ultimatum. I want you to leave the staff within the next seven days. Take whatever of that time you need to get your shit together and get the hell out of here. And don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.

Go ahead; start your own site. See if I give a flying rat's ass. I'll even try to arrange for the OA to host a blog for you or something if it means we never have to deal with you again.

I'll remove your powers myself if you don't go, even if that means I'll have the same done to me. Goodbye."

SJR again plays the victim card and posts this, followed by a reprint of the same aim convo.

22 SJR- "This is because Saiyaman came to me on AIM."

15 Ilj- "Just so you know, GSM, if you try to worm your way around this or delete this thread, I'll post another one just like it - complete with that convo - in the General forum, for all the world to see.

This is your chance to leave quietly without a big fuss."

I try to defend myself and reason with him.

GreatSaiyaman777- "Why?  I have nothing to be ashamed of.  I'm sorry about the remark about Ski but Ski has been rude and insulting to me without any provocation on my part.

I should also point that unlike some people here I haven't spent the past few months talking trash about other staffers behind their back to other staffers for the sole purpose of trying to get them to hate them to help get rid of them.

90% of all my problems and conflicts lie with SJR, and he has always tried everything he can to hype up stuff between me and other staffers just like now.  I've never had other staffers personally insult and treat me like shit up until SJR made it his holy mission to try and get rid of me."

16 Ilj- "Believe me, if I wasn't the type who liked to promote peace and harmony around here, your biggest problem all along would have been me, and SJR would have just been an annoyance.

It was a pain in the ass when you bugged the shit out of just me, but I can take that. When you mess with my friends, that crosses the line.

I am absolutely 100% serious. You will be gone within a week."

I still keep it civil and respond,

""It was a pain in the ass when you bugged the shit out of just me, but I can take that. When you mess with my friends, that crosses the line."

Actually you have it wrong. I have repeatedly tried to be friendly and neutral. Yet you've insulted me repeatedly without me coming to you or insulting others. Any insults on my part have been towards people who've insulted me without provocation.

[url]http://dbzoa.net/forum/showthread.p...25&pagenumber=1[/url]

Oh, and so it's perfectly acceptable for other staff like SJR to harass me left and right but if I stand up for myself then that's all of a sudden wrong? That's a very hypocritical view."

Ilj 17- "In that first thread you were just being a stubborn ass. If you'll read through it again, I tried several times to resolve the issue peacefully with you before I let on how annoyed I was.

Was that ever taken care of, by the way?

In that second thread, I jumped on your ass right away because it was something we had all told you to shut up about a dozen or so times. Nothing spontaneous there."

I still keep it civil and respond,

GreatSaiyaman777- "In that first thread you were just being a stubborn ass. If you'll read through it again, I tried several times to resolve the issue peacefully with you before I let on how annoyed I was."

"A stubborn ass?" Stubborn in that I wanted Psaros's hard work to remain untouched by anyone but him in regards to his last wishes for his site. It turned out that that was exactly what he wanted and after all he's done for Dbzoa he deserves that much. I was not rude or insulting to you in anyway, nor did I deserve to be insulted or responded to rudely.

"I'm speechless. I honestly am. It's an email address. Psaros is not going to give three flips one way or the other. And if he does, he's nuttier than Kam and Jetblack combined.

"Work done by Psaros' hands," pheh! I bet if I visited your home I'd find a bronze idol of the guy on your mantle."

Was that really warranted?

"Was that ever taken care of, by the way? "

Nah. We never really agreed on who'd do it or how Psaros would be able to do it.

"*takes two asprin*

Will ya shut up about the font size? Jesus.

And furthermore, changing it is not going to have any effect on our site traffic whatsoever."

Again, how was it warranted to insult me like this without me saying anything rude to me? If I'm not even insulting anybody in a topic and am simply stating my opinions I don't see why it's okay for other people to come in and insult me out of nowhere and then expect me to take it and be punished if I dare insult back."

Ilj is still raving against me though with a very violent and malicious demeanor.

18 Ilj- "quote:

Originally posted by GreatSaiyaman777

"I'm speechless. I honestly am. It's an email address. Psaros is not going to give three flips one way or the other. And if he does, he's nuttier than Kam and Jetblack combined.

"Work done by Psaros' hands," pheh! I bet if I visited your home I'd find a bronze idol of the guy on your mantle."

Was that really warranted?

I think so, yes. I had fun typing it, in any case.

quote:

Originally posted by GreatSaiyaman777

"Was that ever taken care of, by the way? "

Nah. We never really agreed on who'd do it or how Psaros would be able to do it.

Jesus tapdancing Christ. Are you fucking kidding me? Just...just stop now. You're going to make me want to deadmin you this very second instead of giving you the week that I promised you to do it yourself."

I have been through a LOT of shit because of SJR and also because of Ilj, neither of who want to admit that they've attacked and insulted me frequently without provocation in the past.

I tried getting along with SJR, and I tried simply letting him and Ilj slap me in the cheek nonstop.  If I have bragged about myself and the work I've done in the past, what do you expect when others come up to me to insult me and flame me?  SJR has lied to me, threatened me, insulted me, attacked me and tried to get others to hate me repeatedly in the past.

He also almost got Ilj to kick me off by lying to him about something I NEVER SAID.

That last offense should banworthy in and of itself- almost getting someone kicked out on a lie and using deceptions to try and get rid of someone.  Did anybody here bother to punish SJR or complain to him about doing that to me?  Or does he simply have free reign to do as he pleases?

I don't want anything to do with SJR, he has completely destroyed all levels of trust I can possibly have for him and has created a great deal of stress and animosity.  For that last offense, and everything else he's done, I just want him removed from the staff.  You can't expect me to trust someone who's done nothing but lie to me in the past and almost got me kicked out on a lie.  Every level of trust I've had for SJR he has completely destroyed and betrayed. [/B][/QUOTE]

QuickQuote

I really wish you would have read through the whole report before commenting on it. That being said,

"SJR- "This, however, is wrong. I am going to continue doing what I can for this site, whatever the case may be. I am now, and always have been, proud to be a staff member of this site. If Leia goes, which I hope she doesn't, I'm staying. If she stays, I'm staying. However, if Illy leaves, I'm gonna be pissed, and will take over Illyland. But I'm staying.

Saiyaman, you can go fuck yourself. I'm going to put it to a vote. Ever since the last time you royally pissed me off, I wanted you gone."

SJR- "We did NOT come to a conclusion, dumbass. YOU said that, and no one agreed with you.

I suggest you check out these threads.

http://www.dbzoa.net/forum/showthre...25&pagenumber=2

http://www.dbzoa.net/forum/showthre...=&threadid=4245"

"I didn't hate you until that day, true. But not for the reasons you listed."

"Merchant SJR: Yes, I'm a psycho, and everything I do is a powerplay to take over the site
Merchant SJR: Golllllllllly!"
"Merchant SJR: Me, VGF, Ski, Leia, you, Wedge, Illy, Masa, Kaeli
Merchant SJR: 9
Merchant SJR: Who would vote you off?
Merchant SJR: Me, Wedge, Ski, Illy, Kaeli
Merchant SJR: That's 5
GSaiyaman777: so?
Merchant SJR: So...
Merchant SJR: Simply math
Merchant SJR: That's over half
GSaiyaman777: Ilj, I don't know what his problem
GSaiyaman777: and you and Kaeli must be good friends
Merchant SJR: That's politics for you"

Merchant SJR: I will tell you right now
Merchant SJR: I don't fucking care.
Merchant SJR: Think of me as the obsessive that wants you gone. I don't care."

I have been through a LOT of shit and a LOT of stress because of the harassment I've been through the past several months thanks to SJR. It's no different than what happened to Cleo, except that people actually believed Cleo instead of dismissing what she had to say.

And Ilj also needs to leave me alone too. He's given me a lot of shit even though I've done nothing to him and has "stood behind" SJR in every attack and insult he's thrown at me while acting innocent and "insisting" he doesn't know what hell I'm talking about every time I ask him to stop and treating ever insult as a "non-insult", even though he's insulted me more than anyone else here, and I'm pretty much the only person he targets for insult.

I tried to get along with SJR, he promised he'd "leave me alone" and even after I was getting my own site he still wouldn't stop doing crap like harassing me and editing my work anonymously. SJR also almost got me kicked out on a lie, stating that I was "plannning on leaving the site" which resulted in Ilj trying to kick me off.

"14 Ilj- "I want you gone. NOW. Kevin and Pete are my friends, and I will NOT allow you to talk about them and treat them that way. I asked SJR to readmin me because this has gone far enough. I thought I just needed a vacation from your bullshit, but what everyone really needs is a vacation from you.

This is an ultimatum. I want you to leave the staff within the next seven days. Take whatever of that time you need to get your shit together and get the hell out of here. And don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.

Go ahead; start your own site. See if I give a flying rat's ass. I'll even try to arrange for the OA to host a blog for you or something if it means we never have to deal with you again.

I'll remove your powers myself if you don't go, even if that means I'll have the same done to me. Goodbye."

SJR again plays the victim card and posts this, followed by a reprint of the same aim convo.

22 SJR- "This is because Saiyaman came to me on AIM."

15 Ilj- "Just so you know, GSM, if you try to worm your way around this or delete this thread, I'll post another one just like it - complete with that convo - in the General forum, for all the world to see.

This is your chance to leave quietly without a big fuss."

I try to defend myself and reason with him.

GreatSaiyaman777- "Why? I have nothing to be ashamed of. I'm sorry about the remark about Ski but Ski has been rude and insulting to me without any provocation on my part.

I should also point that unlike some people here I haven't spent the past few months talking trash about other staffers behind their back to other staffers for the sole purpose of trying to get them to hate them to help get rid of them.

90% of all my problems and conflicts lie with SJR, and he has always tried everything he can to hype up stuff between me and other staffers just like now. I've never had other staffers personally insult and treat me like shit up until SJR made it his holy mission to try and get rid of me."

16 Ilj- "Believe me, if I wasn't the type who liked to promote peace and harmony around here, your biggest problem all along would have been me, and SJR would have just been an annoyance.

It was a pain in the ass when you bugged the shit out of just me, but I can take that. When you mess with my friends, that crosses the line.

I am absolutely 100% serious. You will be gone within a week."

I still keep it civil and respond,

""It was a pain in the ass when you bugged the shit out of just me, but I can take that. When you mess with my friends, that crosses the line."

Actually you have it wrong. I have repeatedly tried to be friendly and neutral. Yet you've insulted me repeatedly without me coming to you or insulting others. Any insults on my part have been towards people who've insulted me without provocation.

http://dbzoa.net/forum/showthread.p...25&pagenumber=1

http://dbzoa.net/forum/showthread.p...25&pagenumber=1

Oh, and so it's perfectly acceptable for other staff like SJR to harass me left and right but if I stand up for myself then that's all of a sudden wrong? That's a very hypocritical view."

Ilj 17- "In that first thread you were just being a stubborn ass. If you'll read through it again, I tried several times to resolve the issue peacefully with you before I let on how annoyed I was.

Was that ever taken care of, by the way?

In that second thread, I jumped on your ass right away because it was something we had all told you to shut up about a dozen or so times. Nothing spontaneous there."

I still keep it civil and respond,

GreatSaiyaman777- "In that first thread you were just being a stubborn ass. If you'll read through it again, I tried several times to resolve the issue peacefully with you before I let on how annoyed I was."

"A stubborn ass?" Stubborn in that I wanted Psaros's hard work to remain untouched by anyone but him in regards to his last wishes for his site. It turned out that that was exactly what he wanted and after all he's done for Dbzoa he deserves that much. I was not rude or insulting to you in anyway, nor did I deserve to be insulted or responded to rudely.

"I'm speechless. I honestly am. It's an email address. Psaros is not going to give three flips one way or the other. And if he does, he's nuttier than Kam and Jetblack combined.

"Work done by Psaros' hands," pheh! I bet if I visited your home I'd find a bronze idol of the guy on your mantle."

Was that really warranted?

"Was that ever taken care of, by the way? "

Nah. We never really agreed on who'd do it or how Psaros would be able to do it.

"*takes two asprin*

Will ya shut up about the font size? Jesus.

And furthermore, changing it is not going to have any effect on our site traffic whatsoever."

Again, how was it warranted to insult me like this without me saying anything rude to me? If I'm not even insulting anybody in a topic and am simply stating my opinions I don't see why it's okay for other people to come in and insult me out of nowhere and then expect me to take it and be punished if I dare insult back."

Ilj is still raving against me though with a very violent and malicious demeanor.

18 Ilj- "quote:

Originally posted by GreatSaiyaman777

"I'm speechless. I honestly am. It's an email address. Psaros is not going to give three flips one way or the other. And if he does, he's nuttier than Kam and Jetblack combined.

"Work done by Psaros' hands," pheh! I bet if I visited your home I'd find a bronze idol of the guy on your mantle."

Was that really warranted?

I think so, yes. I had fun typing it, in any case.

quote:

Originally posted by GreatSaiyaman777

"Was that ever taken care of, by the way? "

Nah. We never really agreed on who'd do it or how Psaros would be able to do it.

Jesus tapdancing Christ. Are you fucking kidding me? Just...just stop now. You're going to make me want to deadmin you this very second instead of giving you the week that I promised you to do it yourself."

I have been through a LOT of shit because of SJR and also because of Ilj, neither of who want to admit that they've attacked and insulted me frequently without provocation in the past.

I tried getting along with SJR, and I tried simply letting him and Ilj slap me in the cheek nonstop. If I have bragged about myself and the work I've done in the past, what do you expect when others come up to me to insult me and flame me? SJR has lied to me, threatened me, insulted me, attacked me and tried to get others to hate me repeatedly in the past.

He also almost got Ilj to kick me off by lying to him about something I NEVER SAID.

That last offense should banworthy in and of itself- almost getting someone kicked out on a lie and using deceptions to try and get rid of someone. Did anybody here bother to punish SJR or complain to him about doing that to me? Or does he simply have free reign to do as he pleases?

I don't want anything to do with SJR, he has completely destroyed all levels of trust I can possibly have for him and has created a great deal of stress and animosity. For that last offense, and everything else he's done, I just want him removed from the staff. You can't expect me to trust someone who's done nothing but lie to me in the past and almost got me kicked out on a lie. Every level of trust I've had for SJR he has completely destroyed and betrayed.

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07-29-2004 11:44 AM

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Android Kaeli
Gone Gold Fishing

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Myrtle Beach
Posts: 761

QuickQuote

I've tried to read what you've sent all of us, Saiyaman, but frankly, I'm not going to sort through 40 pages (yes, 40 pages. I put the email in Microsoft Word just to see how long it was. And, sadly, that's without spaces) just to find something small out of all of it.

Granted, some of the stuff shouldn't have happened, but it did. There's nothing you, SJR, or anyone else on the Staff can do about it. What's the past should stay in the past.

I know I haven't done much here and hopefully that will change in the future. But the way that this is going on, I'm beginning to wonder if having to listen to all this is really worth it.

I don't care who started what, who pissed off who, who's calling who what, just end it NOW. Please. The site can't function if the Staff can't.

__________________

Kenkanoshiri: A Kibito Shrine|MuggleNet|A Story For The Ages

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07-29-2004 01:30 PM

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Hiero Antares
Terror of the Universe

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Orbiting the planet Cecropa
Posts: 4268

GSM - Don't do this. I have seen that and I thought I already addressed it. SJR is not going to be removed from staff. Please go back to what I originally said.

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07-29-2004 01:34 PM

SJR
Mystic Kettle of Nackledirk

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Godric's Hollow
Posts: 5199

QuickQuote

I want nothing to do with a fight with you, Saiyaman. I'm not a psychopath that wants you gone--far from it. I said that once at the end of March, that I wanted you gone. It was wrong, and I have since apologized. I have also went over-the-top when dealing with you, more times than I'd like to admit. Please understand that each of those times was not out of malice, but frustration.

I want to work with you. That includes seeing mistakes and bringing them to the staff's attention. I'm not going to lie to you--if I see something wrong, I'll say something. That goes for everyone. And it should also apply towards me, too. If you see something wrong, bring it up in mods, that's what this place is here for. I'm always appreciative of second opinions, to make the site better.

That being said, I will try to be nicer to you. I won't be silent, but I'll voice my opinions in a nicer way.

But understand that it works both ways.

__________________
And now, it's time for Actual Conversations!

Alliance SJR: Anyway, you decided to not throw until you were with someone you wanted to catch it.
Alliance SJR: ....
KijiLinn: *giggles* essentially.
Alliance SJR: That sounds like a really bad euphemism for a gay porn baseball movie.
KijiLinn: *dies*
Alliance SJR: "Hardballs"

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07-29-2004 02:02 PM

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Illjwamh
Darth Illicitus

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Planet Bouncy
Posts: 9348

Why did you post a bunch of stuff that was already in your "report?" Did you think reading it again would change our minds?

Also, that incident where I told you to get the hell out: I've already admitted that I went over the line and have since apologized. More than once, I do believe. I'd had a long day and I heard about you insulting my friends; I acted before thinking it out.

Also, I said I didn't mind you calling me "Illj," but I also asked you to spell my name correctly. I don't think that's too much to ask. There are 2 l's.

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07-29-2004 02:08 PM

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GreatSaiyaman777
Member

Registered: Apr 2003
Location:
Posts: 2447

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by GreatSaiyaman777[/i]
[B] If I don't believe what you're saying then it's for good cause- because you've broken every single promise you've ever made  to me before.  You also spat at me when I apologized to you long ago, choosing instead to reject it and to continue to attack me.

You've put me through a lot stress and you've created a lot of strife here.  When I asked you several time to private message me about any complaints you have about my work here, you chose instead to ignore all of those requests to instead make those complaints as loud and public as possible, instead of trying to handle them privately first.  Ski complained to me a while ago for mentioning something about watching fansubs in an update- but he did so private message.  To date after all these months and my requests, you have never ONCE tried to resolve any complaint about or with me privately.

And the only times you've ever backed off of me were 3 times- the first time your "vote" to get rid of me failed, the second time when you get Illj to try and get rid of me and just now.  You've only backed away when others have asked you to, not because you've ever wanted to or the many times that I've asked you to.

You've been very dishonest and very callous towards to me, and you've created a lot of strife here and caused me a great deal of stress.  You also almost got me kicked out when you lied to Illj about me telling you "I was leaving the site", and I almost left until SSJ Leia stopped me.  And you did nothing to try to stop me from leaving, and you only sang a different tune once she had finished intervening.  For everything you've done to me, all of the lies you've told and promises you've broken, the sheer amount of strife and hostility you've created here and almost getting me kicked out on a lie, I would like you banned.  Either that or you need to be suspended for several months.  After everything you've said and done in the past, you've shown yourself to be very untrustworthy and I don't believe you'll ever stop or truly feel sorry until you've been punished for your callous behavior. [/B][/QUOTE]

QuickQuote

quote:
Originally posted by SJR
I want nothing to do with a fight with you, Saiyaman. I'm not a psychopath that wants you gone--far from it. I said that once at the end of March, that I wanted you gone. It was wrong, and I have since apologized. I have also went over-the-top when dealing with you, more times than I'd like to admit. Please understand that each of those times was not out of malice, but frustration.

I want to work with you. That includes seeing mistakes and bringing them to the staff's attention. I'm not going to lie to you--if I see something wrong, I'll say something. That goes for everyone. And it should also apply towards me, too. If you see something wrong, bring it up in mods, that's what this place is here for. I'm always appreciative of second opinions, to make the site better.

That being said, I will try to be nicer to you. I won't be silent, but I'll voice my opinions in a nicer way.

But understand that it works both ways.

If I don't believe what you're saying then it's for good cause- because you've broken every single promise you've ever made to me before. You also spat at me when I apologized to you long ago, choosing instead to reject it and to continue to attack me.

You've put me through a lot stress and you've created a lot of strife here. When I asked you several time to private message me about any complaints you have about my work here, you chose instead to ignore all of those requests to instead make those complaints as loud and public as possible, instead of trying to handle them privately first. Ski complained to me a while ago for mentioning something about watching fansubs in an update- but he did so private message. To date after all these months and my requests, you have never ONCE tried to resolve any complaint about or with me privately.

And the only times you've ever backed off of me were 3 times- the first time your "vote" to get rid of me failed, the second time when you get Illj to try and get rid of me and just now. You've only backed away when others have asked you to, not because you've ever wanted to or the many times that I've asked you to.

You've been very dishonest and very callous towards to me, and you've created a lot of strife here and caused me a great deal of stress. You also almost got me kicked out when you lied to Illj about me telling you "I was leaving the site", and I almost left until SSJ Leia stopped me. And you did nothing to try to stop me from leaving, and you only sang a different tune once she had finished intervening. For everything you've done to me, all of the lies you've told and promises you've broken, the sheer amount of strife and hostility you've created here and almost getting me kicked out on a lie, I would like you banned. Either that or you need to be suspended for several months. After everything you've said and done in the past, you've shown yourself to be very untrustworthy and I don't believe you'll ever stop or truly feel sorry until you've been punished for your callous behavior.

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07-29-2004 02:39 PM

Illjwamh
Darth Illicitus

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Planet Bouncy
Posts: 9348

No one's being banned or suspended.

And just so you know, if we did suspend/ban SJR (which we're not going to), we'd do the same to you. So drop it.

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07-29-2004 02:44 PM

SJR
Mystic Kettle of Nackledirk

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Godric's Hollow
Posts: 5199

QuickQuote

I never told anyone you were leaving. I had just finished being assaulted by you over my signature, and you had called one of my friends a "whiney bitch who only got on staff because he threatened suicide". I sent that convo to Illy, and said nothing more.

And like I said above--if I see something wrong, I will be vocal about it. I do the same if it is anyone else, and I expect anyone else to do the same if I had done something the wrong way. I'm not going to sugarcoat everything just because criticism will offend you. I will try to be nicer, but if you are going to blow everything out of proportion, I'm not sure why I should bother.

I'm not going to get into another fight with you. Not again. I'm tired, I've had a long day at work, and I have major problems of my own to deal with--I refuse to start anything up with you again.

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07-29-2004 02:45 PM

GreatSaiyaman777
Member

Registered: Apr 2003
Location:
Posts: 2447

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by GreatSaiyaman777[/i]
[B] No, I wouldn't automatically have the same done to me just because "you" say so, the same as when you expected me to banned because you said so.  You're the one who needs to drop it Illj.  Although not as badly as SJR, you have still also attacked me for the past few months a great deal, without me doing anything to you and trying to get along with you.

"Out of respect for all the time you must have spent tracking all of that stuff down, I tried to read the whole thing. I really, honestly did. But I got about halfway through and then just skipped to the end. This is  just the same stuff you keep saying over and over again, and it's not any different now just because you've compiled it into one big list.

SJR has no more influence over my actions than you do, or anyone else for that matter. I act of my own accords, and always have. I'm fairly certain I can say
the same of the rest of the staffers as well.

I strongly recommend you visit a psychiatrist. That is not an insult, but candid advice. Your level of paranoia is unhealthy. Also, your apparent emotional
instability and massive inferiority complex is distressing. You really should get some help. You'll be much happier for it, I guarantee."

Also, you HAVE attacked me frequently, it doesn't matter what you say or believe, that will not change those facts.  I don't have an "inferiority complex" and I am sure as hell not going to drug myself up just because you are too selfish to admit to yourself that you and SJR have said and done a lot of shitty things to me.  If you're that stubborn that you're that unwilling to admit that much to yourself then nothing else you will have to say about this debate will have much substance either. [/B][/QUOTE]

QuickQuote

quote:
Originally posted by Illjwamh
No one's being banned or suspended.

And just so you know, if we did suspend/ban SJR (which we're not going to), we'd do the same to you. So drop it.

No, I wouldn't automatically have the same done to me just because "you" say so, the same as when you expected me to banned because you said so. You're the one who needs to drop it Illj. Although not as badly as SJR, you have still also attacked me for the past few months a great deal, without me doing anything to you and trying to get along with you.

"Out of respect for all the time you must have spent tracking all of that stuff down, I tried to read the whole thing. I really, honestly did. But I got about halfway through and then just skipped to the end. This is just the same stuff you keep saying over and over again, and it's not any different now just because you've compiled it into one big list.

SJR has no more influence over my actions than you do, or anyone else for that matter. I act of my own accords, and always have. I'm fairly certain I can say
the same of the rest of the staffers as well.

I strongly recommend you visit a psychiatrist. That is not an insult, but candid advice. Your level of paranoia is unhealthy. Also, your apparent emotional
instability and massive inferiority complex is distressing. You really should get some help. You'll be much happier for it, I guarantee."

Also, you HAVE attacked me frequently, it doesn't matter what you say or believe, that will not change those facts. I don't have an "inferiority complex" and I am sure as hell not going to drug myself up just because you are too selfish to admit to yourself that you and SJR have said and done a lot of shitty things to me. If you're that stubborn that you're that unwilling to admit that much to yourself then nothing else you will have to say about this debate will have much substance either.

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07-29-2004 03:01 PM

GreatSaiyaman777
Member

Registered: Apr 2003
Location:
Posts: 2447

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by GreatSaiyaman777[/i]
[B] First off, I recently apologized to Ski and he accepted my apology.  I didn't want to bring up that aspect again but I guess you did and you also misquoted it.

You told Crippler I was planning on leaving.  Almost immediately afterwards Crippler came to me on aim and asked me if I was planning on leaving, then said that you had told him that, and you told Illj the same thing.  You lied SJR, and you almost got me kicked out partly on that lie too.  Because you've broken every single other promise you've made you need to be punished for your actions before you'll learn to stop them.

Also (below post) I think you have your definitions mixed up.  Psychologists are the ones who specialize in putting you on the couch and talking to you, psychiatrists are the ones who specialize in giving people medications.

And I don't need "therapy" just because you insist to yourself that you haven't attacked me and insulted me for the past several months when you clearly have.  You're the one who's wrong and you're the one who's "imagining" that all of your and SJR's attacks and insults aren't when they really are.

And if I was "imagining" insults, then it'd stand to reason that I'd complain about other people like Kakashi and Moal who have never insulted me or someone else who's never me before, not complaining about 2 individuals who have attacked and insulted me with frequent occasion for the past several months. [/B][/QUOTE]

QuickQuote

quote:
Originally posted by SJR
I never told anyone you were leaving. I had just finished being assaulted by you over my signature, and you had called one of my friends a "whiney bitch who only got on staff because he threatened suicide". I sent that convo to Illy, and said nothing more.

First off, I recently apologized to Ski and he accepted my apology. I didn't want to bring up that aspect again but I guess you did and you also misquoted it.

You told Crippler I was planning on leaving. Almost immediately afterwards Crippler came to me on aim and asked me if I was planning on leaving, then said that you had told him that, and you told Illj the same thing. You lied SJR, and you almost got me kicked out partly on that lie too. Because you've broken every single other promise you've made you need to be punished for your actions before you'll learn to stop them.

Also (below post) I think you have your definitions mixed up. Psychologists are the ones who specialize in putting you on the couch and talking to you, psychiatrists are the ones who specialize in giving people medications.

And I don't need "therapy" just because you insist to yourself that you haven't attacked me and insulted me for the past several months when you clearly have. You're the one who's wrong and you're the one who's "imagining" that all of your and SJR's attacks and insults aren't when they really are.

And if I was "imagining" insults, then it'd stand to reason that I'd complain about other people like Kakashi and Moal who have never insulted me or someone else who's never me before, not complaining about 2 individuals who have attacked and insulted me with frequent occasion for the past several months.

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07-29-2004 03:09 PM

Illjwamh
Darth Illicitus

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Planet Bouncy
Posts: 9348

QuickQuote

First of all, I said that because you're causing as many problems with this feud as he is. If he went, you would have to as well. It's only logical, and it's the only way fair to do it. But, as I also said, that's not even an issue, because no one is leaving.

Secondly, I don't know why you felt you had to post that email in here, but whatever. And I don't need to admit that I've insulted you in the past, because I've never denied it. You'd have to be an idiot to think that I'd never insulted you. What I have not done, however, is insult you "nonstop," nor have I insulted you exclusively or for no reason. There are a lot of people both here and elsewhere that I really lay into from time to time. As I said yesterday, I will insult someone when I feel they deserve it.

Thirdly, I never said you should drug yourself up. When did I say that? I think taking drugs for that sort of thing is stupid. I'm suggesting therapy.

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07-29-2004 03:09 PM

SJR
Mystic Kettle of Nackledirk

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Godric's Hollow
Posts: 5199

quote:
Originally posted by SJR
I'm not going to get into another fight with you. Not again. I'm tired, I've had a long day at work, and I have major problems of my own to deal with--I refuse to start anything up with you again.

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07-29-2004 03:19 PM

Illjwamh
Darth Illicitus

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Planet Bouncy
Posts: 9348

quote:
Originally posted by GreatSaiyaman777
And I don't need "therapy" just because you insist to yourself that you haven't attacked me and insulted me for the past several months when you clearly have. You're the one who's wrong and you're the one who's "imagining" that all of your and SJR's attacks and insults aren't when they really are.

Again, you're not listening.

quote:
Originally posted by Illjwamh

Secondly, I don't know why you felt you had to post that email in here, but whatever. And I don't need to admit that I've insulted you in the past, because I've never denied it. You'd have to be an idiot to think that I'd never insulted you. What I have not done, however, is insult you "nonstop," nor have I insulted you exclusively or for no reason. There are a lot of people both here and elsewhere that I really lay into from time to time. As I said yesterday, I will insult someone when I feel they deserve it.

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07-29-2004 03:27 PM

Android Kaeli
Gone Gold Fishing

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Myrtle Beach
Posts: 761

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Android Kaeli[/i]
[B] You want to know a funny story?  If you don't, tough shit. You're getting it anyways. :p It's a little long, so if you want to get to the point, scroll down to the bottom.

Well, about a month and a half before I moved down south, I was asked to moderate a RPG at another board I go to (under a different name and different stuff....to make a long story short, I'm like a different person there....feh). I said sure, but I'd be moving in such and such time and probably won't be able to be online for a few weeks while I settle down. Everything was fine with that, yadda yadda yadda, came back, everything was fine.

I modded with two other people, both guys. One was the 'head' mod, who never really was interested in the RPG (read: never joined in) but was good enough anyways as a 'leader'. He quit, so it was just me and the other mod. No problem, right? Right

'Bout a week or so after he left (he never really did much and was never online much either, but that was never a problem--me and the other mod didn't care. We could handle it on our own) or around that time (can't remember. Like I said, he never really joined in much, only did a few 'leadership' things), I started a topic up in the RPG Mod board about picking up the other RPG that we were overseeing.

The other mods, who could see all private forums and who were active in the RPG, joined in the topic and we all started to form this really cool idea and stuff. Over the course of the next few months, getting towards the end of August/beginning of September, we got far enough to a point where we were about to post the information out to the rest of the RPG members.

Not long after we had the 'talks' of telling the rest of the RPG world our plans, the original guy who actually created the whole RPG came back. Now, he was the guy that wanted me personally to be on the RPG mod staff and mod another part of the fourm (yes, this is a little bit of a bragging right here, but :P ) and the one of the people who got the three RPG mods together.

He CLOSED the topic all of us had spent the last month and a half using to create our ideas, made a NEW topic, and I kid you not, if he could he would have said 'Fuck what you've been talking about, it's MY creation in the first place and *I* AM going to do it MY way. Oh, and I'll need some of your ideas as well.'.

I was like, okay. Maybe he'll be nice and we'll incorperate what we've been talking about for a while now into his new idea. WRONG. He didn't like it and he just went about his business like we NEVER talked about it. By then, it didn't matter since most of those that had been talking about it had dropped their interest or left.

I was pissed, yea, because I wanted to use some of those ideas we worked on. His was good too, don't get me wrong, but I thought this would have been a GROUP effort. Not just his.

A few more months passed. I never saw a real reason why he came back in the first place other then to post a few threads in the other RPG and leave. So, I kinda inquired about it with another mod who was still kinda talking with him and this mod said he probably never come back. Right.

Fast forward to April Fools. I started to get some ideas about the RPG since the other one (remember, I was and still am overseeing two RPGs with the other mod) was going a little too slow, but couldn't do anything because the staff was doing this big April Fools joke on the rest of the members, so I stayed in the shadows. I took what the original RPG mod had, reworked some of it, did a HELL of a lot of extra work, and was really proud of it (still am). I think I still have around 20 pages of stuff for this RPG on one of my USB memory sticks somewhere. I spent a good month or so on it, working on it off and on.

Well, I sent it to the other mod, who kinda was doing what the third mod had been doing---a disappearing/reappearing act for the last few months. I sent it to him TWICE so he couldn�t say he wasn�t �in� on everything. I told him I wanted to have this RPG going by the end of May/beginning of June at the latest (if possible), so it gave him plenty of time to work his stuff into it. I sent the second set of emails (this was before Yahoo! introduced the five file sending limit. Probably a few weeks before) to him about a week before Mother�s Day and my birthday. Granted, I kinda forgot about it myself�..

Here�s the kicker: I also had a NEW STICKED THREAD totally devoted to this, where ONE of the original RPG�ers was talking to me about it. She was the only other one who replied, besides myself to her post, at the beginning of April.

The two of us (RPG mods that is) talked about it over IM before one day, I see that he had replied to the thread that was two months old already. Turns out, he and the other original RPG member had cooked up this plot in twenty minutes and posted it in the thread. I thought, well, it�s a good plot if we tweak it a bit. So, after he got all pissy about me not having MSN Messenger (it�s my mom�s account---yea, I�m gonna give it out to everyone that I meet online), I gave it to him and we talked about it.

Turns out, he didn�t want to use ALL of what I had come up with, which was fine by me. I even admitted it was a lot of work to go through. I was browsing the RPG forums at that time and saw that he had posted in the second RPG forum. I checked out the thread and was more then surprised to find it to be none other then a submit-your-character thread, which I didn�t even have any say in creating. He just created it because he thought I�d be okay with it. Right. Yea, I was okay with it.

Also turns out, he didn�t like the �detail� I was adding into the plot, so I said �whatever, we�ll go with what you and the other person came up with� and left it as that.

I was angry. No, BEYOND angry at this. Yea, okay, I didn�t mind the fact that he talked about it with someone else and made a plot for it, but what pissed me off then (and still does) is the fact that he looked at what I had, looked at me, and said �Fuck this, we�re doing it by mine and so-so�s way.� He could have said, �Well, lets work this into this, leave that out, re-work this, and we will see what we can come up with.�

Granted, I could have asked him to help earlier and before I made all of that up, but still. Could have told me something BEFORE he went behind my back and made all this happen.

POINT OF THIS POST (yes, here it is finally! you made it! FINALLY!):

Yea, I made the mistake of creating all of that without him, but he did something back at me as well. I didn�t say anything to him about him doing what he did and he didn�t say anything to me about what I did to him. It was just something that came back upon both of us.

We didn�t get into an argument over what we both wanted into this RPG; we just did it the way that was the easiest. We didn�t spend three months bitching back and forth; we still talk every so often on MSN Messenger and don�t blame each other. We just dropped it then and there without much hassle. Sure, I fumed over it (and I think he did too), but I didn�t get into it with him.

What does this story have to do with the current situation? A lot of stuff could have been avoided if some of this was just dropped when it happened. Fume over it for a while, then drop it. Trust me: everyone would be much healthier if we all did that. [/B][/QUOTE]

QuickQuote

You want to know a funny story? If you don't, tough shit. You're getting it anyways. It's a little long, so if you want to get to the point, scroll down to the bottom.

Well, about a month and a half before I moved down south, I was asked to moderate a RPG at another board I go to (under a different name and different stuff....to make a long story short, I'm like a different person there....feh). I said sure, but I'd be moving in such and such time and probably won't be able to be online for a few weeks while I settle down. Everything was fine with that, yadda yadda yadda, came back, everything was fine.

I modded with two other people, both guys. One was the 'head' mod, who never really was interested in the RPG (read: never joined in) but was good enough anyways as a 'leader'. He quit, so it was just me and the other mod. No problem, right? Right

'Bout a week or so after he left (he never really did much and was never online much either, but that was never a problem--me and the other mod didn't care. We could handle it on our own) or around that time (can't remember. Like I said, he never really joined in much, only did a few 'leadership' things), I started a topic up in the RPG Mod board about picking up the other RPG that we were overseeing.

The other mods, who could see all private forums and who were active in the RPG, joined in the topic and we all started to form this really cool idea and stuff. Over the course of the next few months, getting towards the end of August/beginning of September, we got far enough to a point where we were about to post the information out to the rest of the RPG members.

Not long after we had the 'talks' of telling the rest of the RPG world our plans, the original guy who actually created the whole RPG came back. Now, he was the guy that wanted me personally to be on the RPG mod staff and mod another part of the fourm (yes, this is a little bit of a bragging right here, but :P ) and the one of the people who got the three RPG mods together.

He CLOSED the topic all of us had spent the last month and a half using to create our ideas, made a NEW topic, and I kid you not, if he could he would have said 'Fuck what you've been talking about, it's MY creation in the first place and *I* AM going to do it MY way. Oh, and I'll need some of your ideas as well.'.

I was like, okay. Maybe he'll be nice and we'll incorperate what we've been talking about for a while now into his new idea. WRONG. He didn't like it and he just went about his business like we NEVER talked about it. By then, it didn't matter since most of those that had been talking about it had dropped their interest or left.

I was pissed, yea, because I wanted to use some of those ideas we worked on. His was good too, don't get me wrong, but I thought this would have been a GROUP effort. Not just his.

A few more months passed. I never saw a real reason why he came back in the first place other then to post a few threads in the other RPG and leave. So, I kinda inquired about it with another mod who was still kinda talking with him and this mod said he probably never come back. Right.

Fast forward to April Fools. I started to get some ideas about the RPG since the other one (remember, I was and still am overseeing two RPGs with the other mod) was going a little too slow, but couldn't do anything because the staff was doing this big April Fools joke on the rest of the members, so I stayed in the shadows. I took what the original RPG mod had, reworked some of it, did a HELL of a lot of extra work, and was really proud of it (still am). I think I still have around 20 pages of stuff for this RPG on one of my USB memory sticks somewhere. I spent a good month or so on it, working on it off and on.

Well, I sent it to the other mod, who kinda was doing what the third mod had been doing---a disappearing/reappearing act for the last few months. I sent it to him TWICE so he couldn�t say he wasn�t �in� on everything. I told him I wanted to have this RPG going by the end of May/beginning of June at the latest (if possible), so it gave him plenty of time to work his stuff into it. I sent the second set of emails (this was before Yahoo! introduced the five file sending limit. Probably a few weeks before) to him about a week before Mother�s Day and my birthday. Granted, I kinda forgot about it myself�..

Here�s the kicker: I also had a NEW STICKED THREAD totally devoted to this, where ONE of the original RPG�ers was talking to me about it. She was the only other one who replied, besides myself to her post, at the beginning of April.

The two of us (RPG mods that is) talked about it over IM before one day, I see that he had replied to the thread that was two months old already. Turns out, he and the other original RPG member had cooked up this plot in twenty minutes and posted it in the thread. I thought, well, it�s a good plot if we tweak it a bit. So, after he got all pissy about me not having MSN Messenger (it�s my mom�s account---yea, I�m gonna give it out to everyone that I meet online), I gave it to him and we talked about it.

Turns out, he didn�t want to use ALL of what I had come up with, which was fine by me. I even admitted it was a lot of work to go through. I was browsing the RPG forums at that time and saw that he had posted in the second RPG forum. I checked out the thread and was more then surprised to find it to be none other then a submit-your-character thread, which I didn�t even have any say in creating. He just created it because he thought I�d be okay with it. Right. Yea, I was okay with it.

Also turns out, he didn�t like the �detail� I was adding into the plot, so I said �whatever, we�ll go with what you and the other person came up with� and left it as that.

I was angry. No, BEYOND angry at this. Yea, okay, I didn�t mind the fact that he talked about it with someone else and made a plot for it, but what pissed me off then (and still does) is the fact that he looked at what I had, looked at me, and said �Fuck this, we�re doing it by mine and so-so�s way.� He could have said, �Well, lets work this into this, leave that out, re-work this, and we will see what we can come up with.�

Granted, I could have asked him to help earlier and before I made all of that up, but still. Could have told me something BEFORE he went behind my back and made all this happen.

POINT OF THIS POST (yes, here it is finally! you made it! FINALLY!):

Yea, I made the mistake of creating all of that without him, but he did something back at me as well. I didn�t say anything to him about him doing what he did and he didn�t say anything to me about what I did to him. It was just something that came back upon both of us.

We didn�t get into an argument over what we both wanted into this RPG; we just did it the way that was the easiest. We didn�t spend three months bitching back and forth; we still talk every so often on MSN Messenger and don�t blame each other. We just dropped it then and there without much hassle. Sure, I fumed over it (and I think he did too), but I didn�t get into it with him.

What does this story have to do with the current situation? A lot of stuff could have been avoided if some of this was just dropped when it happened. Fume over it for a while, then drop it. Trust me: everyone would be much healthier if we all did that.

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07-29-2004 04:34 PM

Hiero Antares
Terror of the Universe

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Orbiting the planet Cecropa
Posts: 4268

Look, GSM, SJR made a peace offering to you; I really suggest you accept it, because nothing else is going to happen. He's not leaving the staff. He offered to try to get along with you. The least you can do is say the same.

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07-29-2004 06:10 PM

GreatSaiyaman777
Member

Registered: Apr 2003
Location:
Posts: 2447

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by GreatSaiyaman777[/i]
[B] Well here's my story.

What happens if a kid breaks a window?  You talk to him about and he then apologizes and promises not to do it again.

Much later, he breaks another window.  You talk to him about it again and he then apologizes and promises not to do it again.

No he breaks ANOTHER window.  You talk to him about it again and he then apologizes another time and promises not to do it again.

...........

What do you think that kid's going to go do again?  Break another window.  Words that come out of people's mouths aren't enough if they aren't backed up with actions.  And if they're not backed up with actions, then those words fall hollow like cries of wolf.  SJR needs to be actually punished in some way, not just to say a few words, in order to avoid breaking another window.  I've been through a lot of crap and stress because of him and he needs to be stopped now.  He's been the source of all this hostility these past few months and lying to get somebody kicked out alone, never mind everything else, should be a punishable offense in and of itself.

SJR has made "peace offerings" to me in the past before and he's wound up breaking every one of them and stabbing me in the back repeatedly. [/B][/QUOTE]

QuickQuote

Well here's my story.

What happens if a kid breaks a window? You talk to him about and he then apologizes and promises not to do it again.

Much later, he breaks another window. You talk to him about it again and he then apologizes and promises not to do it again.

No he breaks ANOTHER window. You talk to him about it again and he then apologizes another time and promises not to do it again.

...........

What do you think that kid's going to go do again? Break another window. Words that come out of people's mouths aren't enough if they aren't backed up with actions. And if they're not backed up with actions, then those words fall hollow like cries of wolf. SJR needs to be actually punished in some way, not just to say a few words, in order to avoid breaking another window. I've been through a lot of crap and stress because of him and he needs to be stopped now. He's been the source of all this hostility these past few months and lying to get somebody kicked out alone, never mind everything else, should be a punishable offense in and of itself.

SJR has made "peace offerings" to me in the past before and he's wound up breaking every one of them and stabbing me in the back repeatedly.

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07-29-2004 06:12 PM

Hiero Antares
Terror of the Universe

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Orbiting the planet Cecropa
Posts: 4268

Well, like Illy said, if he's punished then you should be too. If you say it's wrong to try to get someone kicked off the staff--well, that's just what you're doing.

Try to be forgiving. It's not really that hard. We all want to put this behind us; it seems like you're the only one who just won't let it go.

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07-29-2004 06:16 PM

General Grievous
We can sexy

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Coruscant
Posts: 8024

I would think everyone would be really sick of this now.

Seriously - respect Leia's wishes. Are you guys all sooo stubburn that you can't work this out and end the senseless fighting?

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I'm a mushroom cloud makin' motherfucker, motherfucker!

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07-29-2004 06:16 PM

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SJR
Mystic Kettle of Nackledirk

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Godric's Hollow
Posts: 5199

quote:
Originally posted by Ski
Are you guys all sooo stubburn that you can't work this out and end the senseless fighting?

quote:
Originally posted by SJR
I'm not going to get into another fight with you. Not again. I'm tired, I've had a long day at work, and I have major problems of my own to deal with--I refuse to start anything up with you again.

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07-29-2004 06:19 PM

ttb
Child of Too Much Television

Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Palookaville
Posts: 529

QuickQuote

I know I've been on a long hiatus, but like vgf, I've tried to keep up. Saiya, let it go, man. SJR isn't trying to get you kicked out; what was said in the past needs to stay there. You're talking about stress and strife, but what you fail to understand is that the only reason these feelings continue to exist is because you're keeping these issues in the here-and-now. You need to let it go. If you want to take a personal hiatus yourself to get your thoughts together and calm down, that's alright. It would probably be for the best. I'm not talking about a suspension, but just some space from all these issues so you can breathe and just relax. It'll help ease tensions here as well, and when you come back, hopefully things can operate smoothly again.

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